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#42.a - English summary - Good Growth and Risk

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A Dunakavicsok podcast #42.a adásában Nagy Szász István és Kovács Balázs a Duna régió turisztikai jövőjét vitatják meg, különös tekintettel Ausztriára és Magyarországra. Az osztrák kormány turisztikai megközelítésének változásait, valamint a fenntarthatóságról és digitális…

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Dunakavicsok turisztikai podcast
Megjelenés
2025. 09. 20.
Hossz
14 perc
Szereplők, említett nevek
Nagy-Szász István
Témák
turizmus, duna régió, fenntarthatóság
Átirat
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We've got a really um fascinating set of sources today.

They cover what February through August this year.

All about tourism in the Danube region. >> That's right.

And it's not just about, you know, where people are going on holiday. >> No, exactly.

It's about how places like Vienna and Linds are shifting their whole mindset really moving past just counting heads. >> Yeah. >> Uh growth at all costs >> to something more like optimal tourism, finding that balance, >> finding the sweet spot as Vienna calls it.

So our goal today, we want to unpack these, well pretty surprising new strategies from Vienna and Linds.

Then we really need to get into the environmental footprint stuff.

Some of this data, especially on digital. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Well, it's kind of staggering. >> It really is a bit of a reality check. >> Yeah.

And finally, we'll look at how cooperation across the region is actually making these changes happen on the ground. >> Definitely.

And you have to remember the context here.

We've had, you know, really weird weather economic pressures building.

You can't just keep doing the same old thing.

It's about synthesis now, isn't it?

Measurable quality sustainability >> and really thinking about who you want visiting and why, not just volume. >> Okay.

Back in March, they launched this ecosystem strategy 2030.

And the key is that word ecosystem.

It's all about building networks, connecting the dots between arts, the economy, education, the city admin, >> and locals.

That seems crucial. >> Absolutely.

They stress that it's not a tourism plan in isolation.

It's more like a city plan driven by tourism, but for the benefit of everyone living there.

You can't have a thriving visitor economy if it feels separate or even, you know, opposed to local life. >> Right.

And that slogan they came up with, take a risk, visit Linds.

It is provocative, isn't it? >> Yeah.

Just encouraging people to ditch the guide book. >> Pretty much drop your preconceptions, explore things uniquely, find your own lens rather than ticking off a list someone else made.

It's a call for genuine discovery. >> H interesting approach.

And they paired this with that rignosis concept. >> Ah yes, rignosis.

So instead of a prognosis predicting the future, they did a rignosis.

They wrote a kind of history of the future looking back from 2040. >> Right?

That's where those cool um fictional artifacts came from, like the Bitcoin restaurant bill from 2040 >> or the invite to a football match years down the line. >> Yeah.

It makes the future they want feel more tangible, somehow more real. >> Exactly.

It's a creative way to set a direction.

A month later, April, they launched their optimum tourism strategy, >> which was an evolution, wasn't it?

Building on their existing visitor economy model. >> Precisely.

Vienna had already well smashed its 2025 goals.

They had exceeded that four billion euro added value target.

Got 20% more sustainable operators certified. >> So they were hitting the numbers. >> They were.

But they realized I think that just hitting financial targets wasn't the whole picture.

Maybe not even the most important picture. >> Okay.

So they shifted the definition of success.

What are the core ideas in this optimum tourism? >> There are three main concepts they introduced.

First, the sweet spot. >> Right.

We mentioned that the balance point.

Where the visitor experience is great, but it doesn't cost the locals their quality of life.

Second, good growth. >> Good growth as opposed to bad growth. >> Well, yeah.

Growth that actually makes life better for residents.

They gave the example of traffic jams that technically adds to GDP, right?

More fuel sold, more repairs. >> Sure, but nobody wants more traffic jams.

It makes life worse. >> Exactly.

Good growth improves things locally, which means just looking at GDP, it starts to feel a bit irrelevant, doesn't it? >> It really does.

And the third concept, >> the desired guest or vast in German.

Vienna explicitly stated a goal.

They want twothirds of their visitors to be these high-spending types.

Cultural tourists, luxury market, business travelers. >> H okay.

But doesn't that risk skewing the city, making it less accessible, maybe upsetting that sweet spot balance for regular vianese if everything becomes super high-end? >> That's definitely a risk they have to manage.

And their answer seems to be measure everything constantly.

They have this tourism acceptance index. >> Ah, I saw that nine out of 10 vianes are positive about tourism.

That's surprisingly high. >> It is.

And crucially, they've teamed up with UN tourism.

They're measuring sustainability across 11 different areas now. mobility, water use, climate impact seasonality. >> So, it's like a dashboard.

They can see if growth is staying good. >> That's the idea.

Real-time checks to make sure they're not just getting bigger, but getting better for everyone. >> That focus on measurement ties perfectly into the next big topic, the environmental footprint.

And your sources had some uh pretty eye opening data here.

Let's start with the travel industry itself, climate link. >> Right.

Austrian, German, Swiss travel agencies working together.

They want proper scientific ways to calculate the footprint of travel packages. >> We consumers desperately need, right, to make informed choices. >> Absolutely.

That hotel plan example from Switzerland was really stark.

Zurich to Cypress flight and hotel, that's about 1125 kg of CO2 per person. >> Wow.

But the hotel part alone just 55 kg. >> So the flight is almost all of it >> overwhelmingly.

And the goal is to have these kinds of personalized calculations available for everyone booking travel by what 2026. >> Okay, that's progress.

But honestly, the biggest shock for me in these sources wasn't about planes.

It was about well us right >> now.

What we're doing every day online. >> Uh yes, the digital footprint.

If you look globally, the picture has fundamentally shifted.

How so? >> The total ecological footprint of our digital world, making the devices, running the servers, powering the internet, it's now estimated at around 4% of global emissions. >> Wait, hang on. 4%. >> 4%.

About 1.6 billion tons of CO2 every year. >> Seriously?

So digital activity is now a bigger emitter than flying >> globally?

Civil aviation, even at its pre-COVID peak, was around 3%. >> Wow.

I hadn't grasped that. >> The energy demand is just huge.

And it's not just big things. even you know simple interactions we barely think about the energy needed just to say hello to a chatbot for instance it all adds up >> it really makes you reconsider the cost of every single click every stream >> it has to and it puts that global CO2 budget into perspective the sources mentioned the Paris goals to meet them a person's fair share is tiny like 1 to 1.5 tons of CO2 per year >> per year that's incredibly low >> it is and then you look at something Like a roundtrip flight London to Melbourne, that's six tons of CO2 for one person. >> Six tons.

So one flight blows through what?

Four years of your sustainable budget >> easily.

Which makes the next bit of data even more well frustrating. >> The private jets. >> Yeah.

In Austria alone last year, 40,000 private flights registered. >> 40,000.

And how many were domestic? >> About 1,700.

Commercial flights are banned on short routes if you can take a train in under three hours. >> Right.

But private jets, no ban, they can still fly those short hops. >> You're kidding.

So what's the CO2 difference? >> A short private flight pumps out about 1.3 tons of CO2.

Maybe 3.6 kg. >> Tons versus kg.

That's the scene. >> It gets worse.

Apparently 40% of those private flights were empty legs just flying the plane somewhere else with no passengers.

That private jet stuff feels so tangible because it's about choices people could control.

But we need to zoom out again.

Your sources also touched on a crisis with an ecological footprint that just dwarfs everything else. >> You mean the war in Ukraine? >> Yeah.

Finding solid data is tough obviously, but the estimate provided was just staggering. >> It is.

The calculations suggest that over the first 3 years, the conflict generated over 300 million tons of CO2 emissions. >> 300 million tons.

How do we even wrap our heads around that number? >> Well, put it this way.

That's more than the combined annual emissions of Austria, Hungary, Czecha, and Slovakia, all put together. >> Wow.

I mean, beyond the obvious fuel for military vehicles. >> Military fuel use is huge.

But also, think about burning fields and forests.

That alone was estimated at 23 million tons of CO2. >> Just the fires. >> Then there's the destruction of infrastructure buildings roads power plants.

All that has a massive carbon cost to rebuild.

And then there's the global impact of airspace closures, civilian planes having to fly longer routes, >> adding more emissions globally, >> another 24 million tons of CO2 just from rerouted flights.

It really shows the difference between, you know, arguing about small efficiency gains and the colossal environmental cost of conflict. >> Absolutely.

Which I suppose brings us back to focusing on what can be controlled, especially at a regional level.

That's really the heart of that people powered tourism project, the PPT initiative, >> right?

The EU backed one involving 10 countries. >> Yeah.

Stretching out to include Serbia and Muldova, too.

The whole point is to collect and share best practices like Vienna's measurement tools, maybe Linds's ecosystem approach and apply them to solve local problems right across the Danube region.

It's about positive practical action. >> And we saw a nice example of that glo, didn't we? that visit Hungary and Ra Verbong workshop. >> Yes, that was great.

The theme was pure food and local perspective. >> So using super local ingredients, >> hyper local like spices grown in the embassy's own garden, but also embracing concepts like full animal utilization.

Nosetotail eating basically >> treating things often thrown away as valuable. >> Precisely.

They gave the example of smoking beef heart and presenting it as a luxury ingredient.

It's about mindfulness, respect for the resource, minimizing waste, all part of that bigger sustainability picture. >> Okay, so these strategies and ideas sound good, but we need some proof they actually work, right?

That big announcement from Bergenland in July seems like a major win. >> Oh, absolutely.

Bergenland became the first Austrian provin the entire province to get dual sustainability certification. >> Dual.

Yeah, they got the osterikosken which is the official Austrian eco label and turser which is a big international standard getting both across a whole province.

That's huge. >> Must have taken incredible cooperation >> monumental.

The sources said it involves something like 7,200 different businesses and providers 171 municipalities all pulling in the same direction.

It shows this kind of destination stewardship backed by tough standards can be done at scale. >> Okay, that's a definite proof point.

Now, switching gears to over tourism, Venice, they brought in that 5 daily entry fee on the busiest days.

We have data now on how that went. >> We do.

It ran for what, 54 days initially. >> Did it actually cut down the numbers?

Were there fewer people? >> Uh, no, not really.

On those fee days, they still had over 75,000 visitors pouring into the city.

So, as a deterrent, didn't work. >> Huh.

So, was it pointless? >> Not entirely.

One, it raised money about €2.5 million in that first run, >> which they can reinvest presumably >> hopefully.

And two, perhaps more importantly, it gave them the leverage to bring in new rules.

They limited tour group sizes to 25 people max and banned those portable loudspeakers guides sometimes use. >> Uh, tackling the annoying parts of mass tourism, even if not the sheer volume. >> Exactly. addressing the negative impacts on local experience, which ties back to that sweet spot idea. >> Okay, it makes sense.

Let's end the section on uh maybe a more whimsical note.

Vienna tourism working with the European Space Agency, ESA.

They basically beamed the blue Danu Walts, the Blau Donna, out into space towards the Voyager 1 probe. >> Why?

Just because. >> Well, they framed it as correcting a historical oversight.

Apparently, Strauss wasn't included on the golden record sent with Voyager back in 1977, which they felt was a miss. >> A bit of cultural marketing then, >> partly.

But there was a practical kind of cool angle, too.

The sources mentioned that the distinct 34 rhythm of the walts, astronauts apparently use it sometimes to practice movement in zero gravity.

It helps them coordinate. >> No way really.

So, Vianese culture literally helping us navigate space.

That's quite something. # tagoutro.

So I think the big takeaway from all this is the goalposts for tourism have really truly shifted.

It's not just about growth anymore.

The future is all about this measurable good growth about proper destination stewardship and it absolutely requires everyone working together across sectors across borders >> and the measurement is key.

Moving beyond just saying you want sustainability to actually tracking…

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A Dunakavicsok podcast #42.a adásában Nagy Szász István és Kovács Balázs a Duna régió turisztikai jövőjét vitatják meg, különös tekintettel Ausztriára és Magyarországra. Az osztrák kormány turisztikai megközelítésének változásait, valamint a fenntarthatóságról és digitális… Az epizód a Dunakavicsok turisztikai podcast című magyar podcast egyik adása, megjelenés: 2025. 09. 20..

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Megjelenés: 2025. 09. 20.. Hossz: 14 perc. Az epizód a Podiverzumon hallgatható meg: https://podiverzum.hu/podcast/dunakavicsok-turisztikai-podcast/42-a-english-summary-good-growth-and-risk-ba7356dd

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